Hi everyone, In collaboration with the new forummember @Mr.Raven, I have made a simplified version of Inkscape. This simpler version is meant for schools, or beginners. It hides parts of the menus and buttons.
It is an extension that puts 3 files in the user's folder ui.
In this topic I would like you to take a look at the items we have and have not hidden. So if you are interested in this simple Inkscape extension, please look at my svg file here. There is one layer with the default menu items and toolbars. And there is one layer in which I have marked in red what we have hidden in the simple version.
Perhaps you have a different view, so I can still adjust these menus before we will upload the extension to the website.
Looks like a pretty good selection to me. There are a few minor things I might change, but they could be argued either way.
I'd leave the zoom tool enabled. New users are likely to be familiar with the icon, so this makes it clear to them that zooming is a feature they can use. Especially since 1.1 seems to have removed the zoom buttons from the toolbar, this surfaces the feature better than just having the entries in the View menu.
File > Revert - makes it easier for a use to get back to their last saved state if they do something wrong, but it's not essential as they'll often just close the whole window then start again by loading the file.
Edit > Duplicate may not be needed, as users can copy & paste - without the confusion of the pasted version appearing directly on top of the original.
Object > Objects to marker. I think this could be confusing to new users, as the only immediately obvious effect is to remove the object from the canvas.
I'd lose Inset/Outset, and reinstate Dynamic Offset. It offers more flexibility and the UI matches that of Linked Offset.
I think it's a shame to lose the filters menu entirely, but I understand the reasoning. Perhaps if the list was reduced to a few obvious filters which don't require additional input, together with the 'Remove filters' option, though I'm not sure how practical that is with the current capabilities of the UI files. I could see kids having a lot of fun experimenting with the textures and colours if some of these were available though.
Based on my own experience of introducing schoolkids to Inkscape, once they discover the Stars and Polygons tool, you've lost any hope of them being productive for the rest of the afternoon. You could reduce the whole UI down to that one tool, plus a way to set the fill and stroke, and they would still get hours of fun out of it!
Hi Xav, Those are very good ideas! Thank you for taking the time to think about this.
- It was possible to add only one extension. Perhaps that method can work with filters too, I can look into that. I just hadn't figured it out yet, how to add only a few. I agree that they can be a lot of fun.
- So should I make Inkscape for small kids too, with only the Stars tool? My husband has done lessons with Tuxpaint, and those kids were always having a great time. Part of the fun were also the noises. We don't have those in Inkscape :-( That is one reason to make this version, kids and a simpler Inkscape to close the gap between TuxPaint and the bigger tools such as GIMP and Inkscape. And now with the (bèta) extensions manager, who knows how this Simple Inkscape will impact.
One question: I have deleted the Help Menu. But maybe that is a bit too extreme?
Hi Xav, So I have figured out how to make a list of custom filters in the menus.xml file. It is with <verb verb-id="org.inkscape.effect.filter.Roughen" /> This adds the Roughen filter.
Which filters do you think are suited for beginners and/or kids? Then I can add those.
Without going through all the filters one-by-one, I can't really say. But as a general rule I would suggest only having filters that don't open a dialog for editing the parameters, and choosing ones which have a bold and obvious effect. Mostly some of the entries from the Distort, Materials, Overlays and Textures sub-menus.
In my experience kids like getting the biggest effect with the least effort, so something like the Overlays > Swiss Cheese filter would likely work well, whereas Overlays > Blue Cheese would have far less impact. Non-cheese based filters may also be good though 😉
The selection of filters an adult beginner would want is likely to be different - some more subtle textures or blurs, for example. I'm not sure how you best cater for both groups while still keeping a minimal UI.
I also think the idea of a TuxPaint-like vector program is good, but I'm not sure that Inkscape is the best starting point for it. There's so much of the UI that would need to be tweaked and changed for a very young child that it would require a "real" programmer, rather than just hiding parts of the existing design.
Hi Xav, Thank you for the answers. I shall pick some nice filters myself then. Fun, I live in Holland, we have some nice cheeses here.
If grownups are ready for subtle filters, they can just re-install the default interface with this plugin. I am not going to make it too complicated.
Inkscape with fewer buttons can fill in the gap between Tux Paint other open source creative programs. That was my aim at least. At the age of 10 kids might want to learn different things (although there is no limit age limit on TuxPaint. I really enjoyed making some examples for the schoolclasses.)
The complete Inkscape can be overwhelming for both kids and their teachers too. In this way we can lure them in to start using this beautiful powerful program.
@Kirstie I think the approach you're taking will be great for slightly older kids - aged 7 and up, for example. It's a great idea, as you say, for luring them in.
TuxPaint, on the other hand, I've seen used by kids as young as 3 - perhaps even younger. At that age they don't have the fine control and hand-eye coordination needed for some of the UI widgets in Inkscape. Everything would need to be big, chunky and simplified. That's why I think Inkscape wouldn't be a good base to build that on, as it's not really designed for the UI to scale in that way.
Anyway, I wish you luck with this project. It's definitely a worthwhile addition, in my opinion - and perhaps a first "proof-of-concept" step towards having a "UI complexity" slider built into Inkscape itself.
Thank you Xav, Wow 7 years and older? That is still young! I was ehh somewhere in my 30's when I started with Inkscape :-) I think Tux Paint is really cool for kids, especially the smaller ones.
In the Netherlands we see a lot of schools trying to educate lasercutting. They turn to Inkscape. Those are secondary schools, 12 years and older. But the teachers do not have the time to learn Inkscape. They are really struggling with it. And the kids have to install it on their own computers. It gives a lot of trouble..
So I am hoping to create -later- a second simplified version for fablabs and secondary schools for lasercutting. I think this will open up open source software for these rapidly growing groups.
Great that you want to try out the extension! You can already download and install the extension.
It has not yet been published officially with the Inkscape extensions, so therefore it is hard to find. The reason is we still want to change it a little and first have this discussion about which items should be hidden or visible. This forum topic is meant for the discussion of which items should be hidden or visible. Or perhaps we would like more than just the 'default' and 'simple' options. Perhaps a 'lasercutter' option as well or maybe more.
Any ideas, problems, questions, errors, etc. about the extension itself should be posted there. On that topic the extension has been added as an attachment with the first posting. It is a .zip file, which you'll need to download and copy into your extensions folder and then do 'extract here'. Please do read the first post of the other forum topic, it explains how it works and how to install it.
If you have questions or troubles, please don't hesitate to ask.
I asked you for this potential method, because I am working on a project that requires Inkscape simplification. My goal is to let someone, who doesn't know the logiciel at all, manipulate it.
I tried your extension and it worked perfectly. However, I realized that it deleted some icons that I would absolutely need.
That's why I want to know if you think the programming may be possible to do for me, knowing that I never did programming. Do you know approximately how many lines of code that took you ?
Could be possible to create an extension with icons that can be selected or not, to allow me to display only those that interest me ? (Or, if you agree to take time, maybe you could create an extension with a list of icons that I need, that i could send you ? But of course, I am aware that this alternative will take a lot of your time, and I'm ready to pay you if necessary)
acutaly its not that hard you dont realy need to be a developer you just need to find this files and delete buttons that you don't want its really easy to do
User interface customization
Inkscape is starting to use glade files for its dialogues, so they can be reconfigured by users. Only one is currently supported (filter editor).
The contents of the menus can be configured by customising the menus.xml file.
Toolbar contents for the command bar (commands-toolbar.ui), the snap bar (snap-toolbar.ui), the tool controls bars for each tool (select-toolbar.ui), the toolbox (tool-toolbar.ui) is now configurable.
The interface colors and some more UI styles can be customized in <preferences folder>/ui/style.css (very raw theming support).
For editing the .xml and .ui files I used Notepad++ under Windows. All the hidden items are between <!-- and /--> To make them appear again, you have to delete these brackets that are around them: <!-- /--> And then save the files and put it in the user's directory with the name ui. I think you have to rename the files I uploaded here, because they have some longer names now. They should be menus.xml toolbars-commands.ui toolbar-tool.ui
If you try it, but it is too difficult, please ask our help. You can try that for the interface you want.
Creating New Extensions Simple Inkscape: what items do we want?
Inkscape.org
Hi everyone,
In collaboration with the new forummember @Mr.Raven, I have made a simplified version of Inkscape.
This simpler version is meant for schools, or beginners. It hides parts of the menus and buttons.
It is an extension that puts 3 files in the user's folder ui.
In this topic I would like you to take a look at the items we have and have not hidden.
So if you are interested in this simple Inkscape extension, please look at my svg file here.
There is one layer with the default menu items and toolbars.
And there is one layer in which I have marked in red what we have hidden in the simple version.
Perhaps you have a different view, so I can still adjust these menus before we will upload the extension to the website.
Thank you!
Wow that makes it very clear which buttons and menu items have been hidden!
Looks like a pretty good selection to me. There are a few minor things I might change, but they could be argued either way.
Based on my own experience of introducing schoolkids to Inkscape, once they discover the Stars and Polygons tool, you've lost any hope of them being productive for the rest of the afternoon. You could reduce the whole UI down to that one tool, plus a way to set the fill and stroke, and they would still get hours of fun out of it!
Hi Xav,
Those are very good ideas! Thank you for taking the time to think about this.
- It was possible to add only one extension. Perhaps that method can work with filters too, I can look into that.
I just hadn't figured it out yet, how to add only a few. I agree that they can be a lot of fun.
- So should I make Inkscape for small kids too, with only the Stars tool? My husband has done lessons with Tuxpaint, and those kids were always having a great time.
Part of the fun were also the noises. We don't have those in Inkscape :-(
That is one reason to make this version, kids and a simpler Inkscape to close the gap between TuxPaint and the bigger tools such as GIMP and Inkscape.
And now with the (bèta) extensions manager, who knows how this Simple Inkscape will impact.
One question: I have deleted the Help Menu. But maybe that is a bit too extreme?
Hi Xav,
So I have figured out how to make a list of custom filters in the menus.xml file.
It is with <verb verb-id="org.inkscape.effect.filter.Roughen" />
This adds the Roughen filter.
Which filters do you think are suited for beginners and/or kids?
Then I can add those.
Without going through all the filters one-by-one, I can't really say. But as a general rule I would suggest only having filters that don't open a dialog for editing the parameters, and choosing ones which have a bold and obvious effect. Mostly some of the entries from the Distort, Materials, Overlays and Textures sub-menus.
In my experience kids like getting the biggest effect with the least effort, so something like the Overlays > Swiss Cheese filter would likely work well, whereas Overlays > Blue Cheese would have far less impact. Non-cheese based filters may also be good though 😉
The selection of filters an adult beginner would want is likely to be different - some more subtle textures or blurs, for example. I'm not sure how you best cater for both groups while still keeping a minimal UI.
I also think the idea of a TuxPaint-like vector program is good, but I'm not sure that Inkscape is the best starting point for it. There's so much of the UI that would need to be tweaked and changed for a very young child that it would require a "real" programmer, rather than just hiding parts of the existing design.
Hi Xav,
Thank you for the answers. I shall pick some nice filters myself then.
Fun, I live in Holland, we have some nice cheeses here.
If grownups are ready for subtle filters, they can just re-install the default interface with this plugin.
I am not going to make it too complicated.
Inkscape with fewer buttons can fill in the gap between Tux Paint other open source creative programs. That was my aim at least.
At the age of 10 kids might want to learn different things (although there is no limit age limit on TuxPaint.
I really enjoyed making some examples for the schoolclasses.)
The complete Inkscape can be overwhelming for both kids and their teachers too.
In this way we can lure them in to start using this beautiful powerful program.
@Kirstie I think the approach you're taking will be great for slightly older kids - aged 7 and up, for example. It's a great idea, as you say, for luring them in.
TuxPaint, on the other hand, I've seen used by kids as young as 3 - perhaps even younger. At that age they don't have the fine control and hand-eye coordination needed for some of the UI widgets in Inkscape. Everything would need to be big, chunky and simplified. That's why I think Inkscape wouldn't be a good base to build that on, as it's not really designed for the UI to scale in that way.
Anyway, I wish you luck with this project. It's definitely a worthwhile addition, in my opinion - and perhaps a first "proof-of-concept" step towards having a "UI complexity" slider built into Inkscape itself.
Thank you Xav,
Wow 7 years and older? That is still young! I was ehh somewhere in my 30's when I started with Inkscape :-)
I think Tux Paint is really cool for kids, especially the smaller ones.
In the Netherlands we see a lot of schools trying to educate lasercutting. They turn to Inkscape.
Those are secondary schools, 12 years and older. But the teachers do not have the time to learn Inkscape.
They are really struggling with it.
And the kids have to install it on their own computers. It gives a lot of trouble..
So I am hoping to create -later- a second simplified version for fablabs and secondary schools for lasercutting.
I think this will open up open source software for these rapidly growing groups.
@doctormo could be interesting for you
Hello,
I am looking for a method to simplify the comprehension of this software, and I think your extension could be very useful for me, but I don't find it.
Where could I find this extension ? Is it a link to download posted somewhere ? Or how can I hide the icons that I don't want ?
Regards
Hi qtinkscape2,
Great that you want to try out the extension! You can already download and install the extension.
It has not yet been published officially with the Inkscape extensions, so therefore it is hard to find. The reason is we still want to change it a little and first have this discussion about which items should be hidden or visible. This forum topic is meant for the discussion of which items should be hidden or visible. Or perhaps we would like more than just the 'default' and 'simple' options. Perhaps a 'lasercutter' option as well or maybe more.
For the extension itself there is a second forum topic:
https://inkscape.org/forums/extensions/simple-inkscape-extension-children-education-learning-simplified-user-interface/
Any ideas, problems, questions, errors, etc. about the extension itself should be posted there. On that topic the extension has been added as an attachment with the first posting. It is a .zip file, which you'll need to download and copy into your extensions folder and then do 'extract here'. Please do read the first post of the other forum topic, it explains how it works and how to install it.
If you have questions or troubles, please don't hesitate to ask.
Best
Hello @Mr.Raven,
Thanks for responding so quickly,
I asked you for this potential method, because I am working on a project that requires Inkscape simplification. My goal is to let someone, who doesn't know the logiciel at all, manipulate it.
I tried your extension and it worked perfectly. However, I realized that it deleted some icons that I would absolutely need.
That's why I want to know if you think the programming may be possible to do for me, knowing that I never did programming. Do you know approximately how many lines of code that took you ?
Could be possible to create an extension with icons that can be selected or not, to allow me to display only those that interest me ? (Or, if you agree to take time, maybe you could create an extension with a list of icons that I need, that i could send you ? But of course, I am aware that this alternative will take a lot of your time, and I'm ready to pay you if necessary)
Regards
acutaly its not that hard you dont realy need to be a developer
you just need to find this files and delete buttons that you don't want its really easy to do
User interface customization
menus.xmlfile.commands-toolbar.ui), the snap bar (snap-toolbar.ui), the tool controls bars for each tool (select-toolbar.ui), the toolbox (tool-toolbar.ui) is now configurable.<preferences folder>/ui/style.css(very raw theming support).https://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/Release_notes/1.0/en#Customization
Hi @qtinkscape2,
For editing the .xml and .ui files I used Notepad++ under Windows.
All the hidden items are between <!-- and /-->
To make them appear again, you have to delete these brackets that are around them:
<!-- /-->
And then save the files and put it in the user's directory with the name ui.
I think you have to rename the files I uploaded here, because they have some longer names now.
They should be
menus.xml
toolbars-commands.ui
toolbar-tool.ui
If you try it, but it is too difficult, please ask our help.
You can try that for the interface you want.